User:Baltro/Shadow or Spirit Controversy

Anybody having played and beaten The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time will have an opinion in the argument of which temple was meant to come first: the Shadow Temple or the Spirit Temple. Some small basis in the argument can be found on the page Talk:Spirit Temple. However, I see that talk page as inadequate, and as such, I decided to make this page for people to voice their own opinions on the subject.

Please bear in mind that you can do either temple before the other, which is what gives us the controversy in the first place.

For users confused by this ordeal
It is entirely possible to mix up the temples in Ocarina of Time. I may be incorrect, but I believe after getting the Bow from the Forest Temple, you can enter the Fire Temple; likewise, you can enter the Water Temple and defeat Morpha before going anywhere in the Fire Temple. I myself mixed dungeons up a tiny bit: during the period of time when I was stuck in the Forest Temple, I got bored and went and stopped Link the Goron and got my Goron Tunic.

Character Quotes
Let's look for someone who might know something about the other Sages!

That monster! It came out of the well in the village! Let's go check out the well!

Have you ever played the Nocturne of Shadow that Sheik taught you?

The desert...that is where Ganondorf the Evil King was born. If we go there, we might find something...

When evil rules all, an awakening voice from the Sacred Realm will call those destined to be Sages, who dwell in the five temples. One in a deep forest... One on a high mountain... One under a vast lake... One within the house of the dead... One inside a goddess of the sand...

In favor of Shadow Temple first

 * Navi points towards Kakariko Village as your next destination right out of the Water Temple.
 * Going to Kakariko Village starts the fire scene, which obviously points towards the Shadow Temple.
 * After the fire scene, Navi will bother you about "...playing the Nocturne of Shadow that Sheik taught you...", indicating you should warp to the graveyard and enter the Shadow Temple.



In favor of Spirit Temple first

 * The order of the Medallions on the menu screen indicates clockwise:
 * Light Medallion
 * Forest Medallion
 * Fire Medallion
 * Water Medallion
 * Spirit Medallion
 * Shadow Medallion


 * The same follows for the list of Ocarina tunes on the menu.
 * Appearances of the Sages in the ending credits (such as flames, pictured at the bottom, or themselves, pictured at the right) give the impression of Spirit first.

Voting
For voting, please sign your comment with three tildes instead of four, because the time you posted is irrevelant, and merely takes up more space. Please also remember to post your comment with a # sign in front of it, not an asterisk (*). Finally, please refrain from using word bubbles. They take up waaaay too much space in general, and I'm not sure they would even function properly inside the table cells.

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size="4">Current Winner: Shadow Temple A discrepancy between the last two temples in The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time.
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Votes for the Shadow Temple first

 * 1) If I may be the first to vote, I shall vote in favor of the Shadow Temple. Frankly I was too lazy to rescue the carpenters, and my 'Navi'gation system pointed me to the Shadow Temple, which was all I need.  Baltro [  talk  ]
 * 2) I think that the shadow temple should come first. I haven't actually beaten the Spirit temple, but I'm pretty sure you need the Lens of Truth, and the Hover boots to complete it, and I just followed the game storyline to the shadow temple. Killerbread bug72
 * 3) I have no idea why they put the Spirit Medallion/Requiem of Spirit before the Shadow Medallion/Nocturne of Shadow, but I personally think that the Shadow Temple should be completed before the Spirit Temple, both because Navi tells you to go to Kakariko Village, and also because, contrary to what AuronKaizer said, I think that the Spirit Temple has a more climactic feel to it, since it involves the main villain's race and whatnot.  Xykeb   Yvolix   Zraliv 
 * 4) I always did shadow first and evry stragy guide I've looked at says shadow comes first.  Metroidhunter32 

Anonymous votes

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Votes for the Spirit Temple first

 * 1) I've always done the Spirit Temple before the Shadow Temple. The Spirit Medallion comes before the Shadow Medallion on the quest item screen. The Shadow Temple has more of an air of finality to it, as well. And with the Hover Boots found in the Shadow Temple, certain puzzles in the Spirit Temple are easier to accomplish, indicating that they are not supposed to have been obtained yet. My memory's a bit blurry here but I do believe that you can complete the Spirit Temple without the Hover Boots. So in short, most of the evidence, if I may call it such, points to the Spirit Temple being the penultimate temple and the Shadow Temple being the final one. -- Auron  Kaizer Talk loud, hit harder!
 * 2) I've always beaten spirit before shadow. I've even beat Spirit before water. Solar flute
 * 3) I loved this part of the game mainly because of the gerudo. Plus, before I even got this game much less knew about it, I had a dream about it, I was walking through the entrance and pots got thrown at me, then the statues attacked me, then when I saw it when my dad and I were playing it, I was like "Zomg, I've seen this before!"  Plus, I had nightmares about the shadow temple, that I got killed with that blades. Xicera

Anonymous votes

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Random thoughts
Hmm, well I always assumed that the reason why Navi directs you to Kakariko after the Water Temple is because you need the Lens of Truth to find the "spirit guide" in the Haunted Wasteland...but that's me. -- Auron  Kaizer Talk loud, hit harder!

Killerbreadbug72, you don't need to do the Shadow Temple to get the Lens of Truth and you don't need the Hover Boots to complete the Spirit Temple.  Xykeb   Yvolix   Zraliv  22:29, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Well, Baltro, I can tell you, after putting in a talk bubble and using the preview button, that putting them in there stops the whole thing from functioning properly....the talk bubble itself shows up fine, though. Oh, and Solar flute, it doesn't matter what you do, it matters what you think the creators intended to be done (upon looking at that sentence, it looks kind of rude....I promise you I had no rude intentions when writing that). In fact, the first times I played Ocarina of Time, I did the Spirit Temple before the Shadow Temple and was shocked when I found out you could do the Shadow Temple first, but now I actually agree that the Shadow Temple is first.  Xykeb   Yvolix   Zraliv  06:22, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, I agree Xykeb, that just the order you happen to do the temples in isn't really that much; I think what is important is opinions based on the two contrasting sides (Navi and the Medallion order)  Baltro [  talk  ] 00:14, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

HEY add as a fact that the Ocarina of Time Manga has the Spirit Temple as the last… --TheNewSheik 23:12, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

I don't know about that. The manga isn't canon, but on the other hand, it should be canon enough to get the order of the dungeons right. Then again, I could be totally wrong (I don't really know anything about the manga) and they could just do them out of order regularly. In any case, I guess my point is that that's not exactly a strong argument, but it could help point us in the right direction.  Xykeb   Yvolix   Zraliv  02:17, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

By the way, that Navi quote about checking out the well is what I interpret to be a poorly made pointer about getting the Lens of Truth, which I assume the creators, while not making it required to do so, intended to be obtained before completing the Shadow Temple.  Xykeb   Yvolix   Zraliv  02:28, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

To the comment above, I have added that highly legimate reason and replaced the original explanation with it.  Baltro [  talk  ] 00:57, 31 October 2008 (UTC)

Um.....Xicera, how does that imply that the Spirit Temple comes first?  Xykeb   Yvolix   Zraliv  00:05, 1 November 2008 (UTC)
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